Discussion:
Flowmeter for fire pump testing
Karen Lesko
2016-05-10 20:40:46 UTC
Permalink
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter
on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is
broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would
like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody
aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi
type?

Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
Mark Phillips
2016-05-10 20:46:49 UTC
Permalink
Rosemount 3095 I think is FM for Fire Protection

But its been a long day

From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-***@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Lesko
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2016 4:41 PM
To: ***@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: Flowmeter for fire pump testing - Character set not allowed


We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi type?

Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
Brad Casterline
2016-05-10 22:08:50 UTC
Permalink
I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in the
flow path and apply Bernoulli's Principle:
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?
Post by Karen Lesko
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter
on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is
broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would
like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody
aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi
type?
Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Brad Casterline
2016-05-10 22:18:30 UTC
Permalink
Correction - half the density, not the mass I think. And I should do some
googling I guess- the old annubar stuck down through a hole in the top of
the pipe like a flow switch right? Whereas you would have to cut out a
section of pipe to install a venturi?
Post by Brad Casterline
I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?
Post by Karen Lesko
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter
on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is
broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would
like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody
aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi
type?
Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Karen Lesko
2016-05-10 22:24:23 UTC
Permalink
The existing flowmeter is leaking and is not repairable. It would be nice
to get a replacement that fit into the existing hole in the pipe instead of
replacing a section of piping to install a venturi.

Sent using CloudMagic Email
[https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=pa&cv=8.4.52&pv=5.1.1&source=email_footer_2]




On Tue, May 10, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Brad Casterline < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
Correction - half the density, not the mass I think. And I should do some
googling I guess- the old annubar stuck down through a hole in the top of
the pipe like a flow switch right? Whereas you would have to cut out a
section of pipe to install a venturi?

On May 10, 2016 5:08 PM, "Brad Casterline" < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in the
flow path and apply Bernoulli's Principle:
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?

On May 10, 2016 3:40 PM, "Karen Lesko" < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter
on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is
broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would
like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody
aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi
type?

Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753 [tel:803-221-0753]


_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
***@lists.firesprinkler.org
[***@lists.firesprinkler.org]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org

[http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org]
Brad Casterline
2016-05-10 22:35:46 UTC
Permalink
Sure. I think flow meter readings are supposed to be verified every so
often with full test header type measurments. Does it leak all the time or
just during tests? Has it been matching what the verifying flow test says
over the years?
Post by Karen Lesko
The existing flowmeter is leaking and is not repairable. It would be nice
to get a replacement that fit into the existing hole in the pipe instead of
replacing a section of piping to install a venturi.
Sent using CloudMagic Email
<https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=pa&cv=8.4.52&pv=5.1.1&source=email_footer_2>
Correction - half the density, not the mass I think. And I should do some
googling I guess- the old annubar stuck down through a hole in the top of
the pipe like a flow switch right? Whereas you would have to cut out a
section of pipe to install a venturi?
Post by Brad Casterline
I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?
Post by Karen Lesko
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type
flowmeter on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The
flowmeter is broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant
flows. We would like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation
line. Is anybody aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to
switch to a venturi type?
Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Karen Lesko
2016-05-11 12:52:58 UTC
Permalink
Our pump recirculates to a 300,000 gallon tank and not directly to the
suction. We do hydrant flows annually now but would to recirc for 2 years
and flow test the third year.

The old flowmeter leaks all the time, but when it was used in the past
(before it started leaking) it did correlate well with hydrant flow test
data.

Karen

Sent using CloudMagic Email
[https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=pa&cv=8.4.52&pv=5.1.1&source=email_footer_2]




On Tue, May 10, 2016 at 6:35 PM, Brad Casterline < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
Sure. I think flow meter readings are supposed to be verified every so
often with full test header type measurments. Does it leak all the time or
just during tests? Has it been matching what the verifying flow test says
over the years?

On May 10, 2016 5:24 PM, "Karen Lesko" < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
The existing flowmeter is leaking and is not repairable. It would be nice
to get a replacement that fit into the existing hole in the pipe instead of
replacing a section of piping to install a venturi.

Sent using CloudMagic Email
[https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=pa&cv=8.4.52&pv=5.1.1&source=email_footer_2]




On Tue, May 10, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Brad Casterline < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
Correction - half the density, not the mass I think. And I should do some
googling I guess- the old annubar stuck down through a hole in the top of
the pipe like a flow switch right? Whereas you would have to cut out a
section of pipe to install a venturi?

On May 10, 2016 5:08 PM, "Brad Casterline" < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in the
flow path and apply Bernoulli's Principle:
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?

On May 10, 2016 3:40 PM, "Karen Lesko" < ***@gmail.com
[***@gmail.com] > wrote:
We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter
on the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is
broken so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would
like to be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody
aware of a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi
type?

Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753 [tel:803-221-0753]


_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
***@lists.firesprinkler.org
[***@lists.firesprinkler.org]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org

[http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org]


_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
***@lists.firesprinkler.org
[***@lists.firesprinkler.org]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org

[http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org]
Russell & Carol Gregory
2016-05-11 03:26:56 UTC
Permalink
A few years ago I replaced an Annubar unit with a Preso Ellipse
(www.preso.com) unit. Still a probe type sensor but may need a change of
weld socket on pipe.



Russell Gregory

Christchurch New Zealand



From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-***@lists.firesprinkler.org]
On Behalf Of Karen Lesko
Sent: Wednesday, 11 May 2016 10:24 AM
To: ***@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: Flowmeter for fire pump testing



The existing flowmeter is leaking and is not repairable. It would be nice to
get a replacement that fit into the existing hole in the pipe instead of
replacing a section of piping to install a venturi.

Sent using CloudMagic Email
<https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=pa&cv=8.4.52&pv=5.1.1&source=email_fo
oter_2>



On Tue, May 10, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Brad Casterline <***@gmail.com>
wrote:

Correction - half the density, not the mass I think. And I should do some
googling I guess- the old annubar stuck down through a hole in the top of
the pipe like a flow switch right? Whereas you would have to cut out a
section of pipe to install a venturi?

On May 10, 2016 5:08 PM, "Brad Casterline" <***@gmail.com> wrote:

I thought annubar and venturi were synonymous. Create a constriction in the
flow path and apply Bernoulli's Principle:
~where the velocity of a fluid is high the pressure is low and, where the
velocity of a fluid is low the pressure is high~
The change in pressure is half the mass times the velocity squared
(Bernoulli's Equation).
How is it broken? Something clogged up?

On May 10, 2016 3:40 PM, "Karen Lesko" <***@gmail.com> wrote:

We have a mid 1980s fire pump installation with an annubar type flowmeter on
the line that recirculates to the fire water tank. The flowmeter is broken
so we have been testing our fire pumps with hydrant flows. We would like to
be able to do some testing with our recirculation line. Is anybody aware of
a listed annubar flowmeter or do we need to switch to a venturi type?

Karen Lesko
Fire Protection Engineering
SRR, LLC
803-221-0753
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...